I think it DEFINITELY matters & I’ve noticed it too. The lines are continually becoming more & more blurred between art & ads on TV, in print, online. I think it’s sadly indicative of our overly consumptive cultures though… we’re starting to lack the desire or ability to separate art & advertising. For the advertisers this is probably a major positive, making it easier & easier for them to deliver their messages to the masses… I’m not sure I’d say the same for us in a cultural sense!

That is the sad thing about today’s print media, there is no distinction between art and ads. No one really cares do they? People look through magazines for sensationalism, not art. Ads catch their eye, they are all about buying and spending. Sad fact of today’s lifestyle.

Art mirrors life and we are a culture of consumers. You gotta get in there and find the art that reflects a different reality! But you probably won’t find it in a magazine

I think ads are becoming more and more artistic all the time and I don’t see that as a bad thing. Ads might be about selling us stuff but we don’t have to buy. We can enjoy beauty without having to ask who is bringing it to us. Or am I missing the point?

I have noticed that as well, the line really is getting more blurred all the time. I do know that a lot of the things that inspired me as a child to create art were very much based on magazine covers, print adverts and posters. These are things that still inspire me, to a point. I don’t necessarily think it is a bad thing but, it is good to recognize that it is definitely happening. It think that ads can be a form of art. I think of the iconic ads of the 50’s and 60’s, these are things that have stuck with us. So much so, that a lot of the art in advertising and fashion is obviously still inspired by that time.

Hi David et all

I think the distincions are pretty straight forward, commercial art (art as persuasion) vs art as form of personal reflection and self-discovery. I have been in the business for years. There is a phenomenal section in ‘Man and His Symbols’ by Jung on psychology and art - a must read!

Here’s my folio
http://stevenixondesign.blogspot.com

Best to all Steve

You have a point David, this era brings about much confusion, making it hard to balance what we see and translate it all into concrete within our minds. Well another matter to ponder upon… Have a beautiful day David!!!

I think it matters too. Those uber-hip mags are aiming at a demographic that eats that stuff up without really thinking about it or appreciating that there should be a distinction. I mean, I read them too, and the aesthetic is part of what makes them so appealing. If the ad for the shoes I want is hip, then so are the shoes right? However, the flip side is that at least there are creative peeps out there making the ads that would inevitably be there into something worth looking at. What does make the distinction in the end…the platform? The intention?

It’s a very rare thing for me to look at a magazine anymore because they are so chocked full of advertising. I may browse in a bookstore or coffee shop but I never buy because I can’t see paying a huge price for something more than half full of advertising. I’m getting that way with television and cable, too. Commercials and infomercials are getting longer and programs are shorter. We are battered by advertising everywhere and to pay to be advertisted at just bugs me.

I believe the difference between art and advertising is important. Advertising is aimed at manipulating you to buy something; convincing you that you have to have it. Ads can be artistic, but their purpose isn’t to draw attention to themselves, but to the product they are geared to promote.

To me, art is created to be enjoyed, admired, shared and to stimulate thought and conversation. Sometimes art is meant to shock you or challenge your perspective. I know artists want to make a living from their art, but they aren’t out to manipulate you into buying it. They want you to appreciate their work enough to want to bring it home and they hope you will stick around and see what they’ll do next. Advertising just wants you to buy now and if ads have to try and make you believe you’re ugly, stupid or fat to get you to dig into your wallet and buy, they will. There isn’t a lot of integrity in advertising anymore.

There’s also a blur between tabloids and news these days, not just art and advertising. I find it all really disturbing.

I think the trend began to take off as GenY became more important to advertisers (1990’s) and has finally been just about perfected now. The Y’s were considered a rather cynical bunch, advertisers started working harder at disguising their ads. Helps that the creative department of an ad agency is one of the only well paying outlets for visual artists these days. Many are talented artists in the truest sense; they just don’t buy into the starving part.

Does it matter? I think so. I worked in the industry long enough to know the difference, but I’ve also met quite a number of people who are astonished to realize that much of the editorial content in some publications is a result of ad agency press releases, “free samples” sent to publications and some just straight up bought and paid for. Scary.

I agree that art reflects society, but I also feel it has the power to mould it. While I appreciate creativity in all media, is important to keep in mind the motivation behind it. CocaCola gave us our Santa Claus. Does a multinational corporation really deserve to define our culture?

Jean Kilbourne in “Killing Us Softly” states that advertising is the most powerful force that teaches attitudes, that in turn can shape and influence our culture. Some people think that they are not influenced by ads; that they are “personally exempt” but with over 1500 ads seen or heard a day, an individual can still be effected subliminally.

The lines are blurring because no longer are we a one stop shop society. Every top celebrity has their own perfume or fashion line along with their hand in the music, book and/or movie industry. eg. JLO, Beyonce, JT, Hilary Duff, Gwen Stefani, Jay Z. to name a few. It’s over saturation in my opinion. Too much monopoly for my brain. Everyone starts to look the same, act the same and speak the same. It’s hard to know whether art is imitating life or life is imitating art.

What’s to stop a newspaper or magazine from “Creating” images as a tool for “propaganda”. Staging a photograph to get a point across, rather than taking an actual picture of an event. Again, news or art? I agree David that it’s hard to tell these days where the distinction lies. I saw a photograph in Dazed And Confused of what looked like human carcasses draped hauntingly over a pile of garbage. At first I thought it was a picture from the Holocaust, but when I looked again I realized it was staged. I couldn’t tell if it was a photograph, an ad, a painting or a computerized image. Interesting and offensive…but it did make me think. What exactly are we supposed to be thinking about? Things that make you go “hhmmmm” ;-0

@ElizabethLouise - I totally agree that corporations don’t deserve to define our culture. I’m old enough to remember when companies gave you stuff free just so you would wear their name or logo and therefore advertise for them for free. Now, those same companies are getting people pay LOTS to wear their names on their backs (GAP, Roots, Nike, etc.)It’s like people are getting their status, self-worth from being able to afford to wear the big name brands. It seems pretty backward and scary to me.

P.S. Don’t advertisers have control over what is printed in magazines and newspapers? Or what gets reported in the news? Just asking? What about record labels? How many artists complain about having to fight for their artistic integrity. Where the dollar comes from seems to determine the art, so to speak.

I think it matters, but maybe it’s a leftover feeling or value of the old generation of media and technology, and even what it means to be art.

I think there’s a lot of arts in ad, and ads drive the need for artistic talents, so that they can reach out to their target audience.

I’m surrounded by people in the marketing field who go into it because of their love for art. My sister, my sister-in-law, and my husband, all join the field in different forms, because they are artists in their own ways, and perceive things in design and aesthetic qualities. They know they can express themselves in it, but also get messages across using art. Art is a powerful instrument and medium.

So I think it’s only natural that art becomes so crossed over and intertwined with ads and marketing.

Now, what are ads? They are meant to sell an item or product/services by giving some kind of information and also drawing on the appeal of the target audience. If the ads that use art so integrally (thus drawing on audience appeal) does not provide much information, then I think it starts to matter.

But then again, arts, at least the way I perceive it, is also a propaganda, or medium for messages to be expressed. It’s a propaganda for the artist, the creator, so they can express their message or feeling or perceptions. In that regard, arts is very similar to ads, isn’t it? They both get messages across.

An expression of one’s thoughts, perception, believes can never be sold.

Does David ever come here to comment is this a promotional gag?

Steve

David does indeed comment. Just read through some of the threads.

nowadays, “art” blends with the “ad” to captivate the audience…they can be vague or a straight line art, pictures, texts, colors, and backgrounds - i see it as a form of art but not to the real level..art for me is the old school way of producing a piece and that is by hand…no more no less…with the invention of computers and softwares, art is being translated into a digital media/form where the old meets the new….i think it matters that real art should be respected

yeah…just read through it

Thanks for the reply Kat

Steve

I think ads have a very different feeling than a true piece of art does, it depends on the person viewing it, when you look at true art it should provoke a feeling, you should wonder what the artist was thinking when they created it, true art makes the viewer step out of reality and into the mind of the artist, even if your thoughts on it are totally different from the true meaning, Ads do not do that, they try to seduce you with images that make you want to fit into or conform to whatever it is they are trying to sell,that’s why you feel nothing, unless you want to fit into the status they are trying to sell.

I believe in art.

My Grandma passed away last week and she was by far my best friend. She lived a very simple life and her life was filled with artwork and her life is art. Her paintings, I have one here and it is beautiful, beautiful to me. I wonder if you would see what I do? It is about perceptions and values and part of the beauty of the art is the knowing of the heart and history of the one who created it.

You discovered what many women’s magazines contain, one big fat commercial. So I ask, do you exist or are you commercial? Are you art or an ad?

When I think about commercial ads it is like they pass quickly from memory unless they contain a catchy i have fallen but i can’t get up message.

Art, on the other hand, is timeless.

I care and try and be aware David.

I’m not sure this is a trend that can be isolated to our time or blamed on present consumer culture. Several illustrious artists in the past have created amazing pieces that were originally commissioned as advertisements. For example, Alphonse Mucha’s work can be seen on everything from theater posters to biscuits (even back then his Art Nouveau stylings were percieved as novel and ingenious). These pieces have now become ingrained into the collective consciousness as great works of art, despite their original purpose. Often, the same folks arguing for the “integrity” of art are the same ones who have vintage wine ads hanging in their living room.

I think also the trick now is that as we continue to develop as a society, the opportunities and means for self-expression have increased vastly and creative acts are no longer limited to those who see themselves exclusively as artists. We are starting to see this applied across all fields, from ads to industrial design to software UI, so its slowly becoming the standard and not the exception that something is effective, beautiful and innovative all at the same time.

I think it matters for sure distinguishing between art and ads. I’ll take my sports analog. Today we see professional athletes being used to sell this product or that product and the “art” being used in these ads is quite flashy and young people buy into this so easily so that say Nike or Reebok for example becomes more than just a shoe company or sports clothing company, it becomes the conscious symbol or icon that kids relate to and then wear. And all sorts of companies outside of sports are doing this, getting their product into the minds of young people so this then becomes the culture of the people. I find this scary but large companies know what they are doing. And doing it all over the world, you see clips of kids in African countries wearing NFL or NBA stuff, and the artistic element is being used to sell the products worldwide. Again I find this a bit scary.

Forgot to say that true art, art being created for absolutely no commercial purpose, is very important as it helps define who we are as a people, society, nation. That being said, I don’t mean that only art that is made with no commercial purpose is true art, of course not. But there is nothing like just going outside and playing a game of catch a football with your wife (which we do, we don’t have kids), or doing anything recreationally with no purpose other than you enjoy doing it, whatever it is. And if you are doing something artistic that you do, in fact, wish to sell to put food on your table, then if you do it with the spirit of it’s art for art sake, then I think it will be a better finished product in the end.

David, when I see you perform, you do come across to me as someone who I think produces your art from scratch in a very non-commericial, organic way, very much from the heart and with your own expression. yes, you do have a family to feed etc, we all know that, but you seem to be someone who was born to be an artist and create from the heart. Both myself and my wife love how you relate to people, like in St. Catharines you got people on the stage and also talk to the crowd. This is part of your art, who you are, and it’s great, to me a non-commercial part of you.

@Cassadaga- You have a point about vintage ads being used as art-deco in homes as a form of self-expression. Many people collect old canisters etc. with ads on them and use it for decor or as art pieces. I like seeing a really creative ad. I just don’t appreciate it when they tie the ads into an article. It makes you wonder if the article is written as a means to sell more of the product. Pharmaceutical companies are famous for that!

Yes and I would say that is an abuse of art companies doing that. But I suppose if the commercial artist is being paid quite well, which they should especially in a case like a pharmaceutical company where they make tons and tons of money even in a recession (don’t get me started), then that is fine, obviously, it is afterall commercial art.

i think over time and in abundance art has become somewhat commercialized. it no longer takes a good artist to be recognized, there are too many out there. those that are good make it with marketing and those that are good usually stay hidden and possibly credited in retrospect. society has a critical eye, we value technique over subject which to me includes style. i really think there is much more to say in the underdog of art before and if it hits mainstream it then becomes a matter of love or hate it. but everyone nowadays is producing art the range is too big, so instead of investing the time majority of us can only value what many of us already know and we end up making comparisons to what is thrown in our faces which in my mind art should transcend. then again we all need to make money i think it may be more a question how much.., it’s a tricky situation.

the line that distinguishes art from and advertising is indeed blurred. however, for me art is something that is worth spending so much time into perfecting. art for me is to achieve resonating and replicating beauty for a lifetime (sometimes even for more than a lifetime. art is the sincerest form of expression of emotion, thought, and intent. to me advertising is very temporal, fleeting. true art is definitely not fleeting, it is supposed to live forever.

and to answer your question david, yes, i still do believe in art.

I do. I believe in art because everyday I feel that kind of needs art gives. we can choose to let explode it or to stop your eyes on what’s not that much important…real art is essential for our own each life,when your heart is connected with art…any kind of art. I don’t mind magazines…But I think to myself,if I feel that kind of needs,surely art is still alive!

How to believe in the world, if even the world doesn’t exist?.. and what about ads?
Very often sitting with scissors in hands and looking for the inspiration between lines I of course notice what you said about.
I can’t know an ad you saw exactly, but anyway the fusion is better than some stupid triteness.
The ad-makers are caring about this; they’re trying with all strength to produce something unusual and effective. they’ve got their own tricks and often make fusion to reach the task. is it not the art to make an art from ad?..however magazine is hardly the best place to look for the pure art

Maybe I am completely lost, but I think that there are more and more artists out there, as the society evolves. Visual art artists have difficulties living from their art…so it is natural that they find “regular” jobs, in publicity, video games design, illustration… where they still can express themselves but where they can also earn money.

Can an ad be called a piece of art? If the illustration is made by an artist, why not…

I think that as time goes by, art will be more and more present in ads…for better or worst!

i’m a starving graphic artist…. and i totally understand what you meant julie…art comes from deep within

Here’s the thing: *sometimes,* it doesn’t matter to me. Other times, it really does. With that in mind, I want both to be labeled enough that I know. I HATE feeling like I don’t know which is which. If you’re doing something creative and selling? Cool. But just share that part.

I have to tell you. I’ve been working all week with three guys from New Brunswick, and one of them over dinner today said he really loved your work. He’s seen you two or three times, and he was REALLY excited that you were out commenting on blogs, and when he followed the link back to YOUR blog from mine, he was *really* excited that you’re blogging.

Cool how comments can do that, eh?

He talked you up so much I like you even more than I did before. Who knew? : )